Low idle speed & fuel flooding engine

[Aaron]

Hi,

I need some advice,

Twice today i have had fuel flooding my engine, also i've noticed problems keeping the car running when idle.

One time it happened as i was leaving from an MOT & they mentioned something about the injection?

[stunned_monkey]

I'm afraid it's a "how long is apieceof string" question. It could be flooding, but it's unlikely if you passed the emissions test. It's more likely to be under-fuelling, or a problem with the idle control system.

[NickT]

As a quick test try disconnecting the electrical connection from the cold start valve. This is blue in colour and on the top of the engine to the left slightly. If the thermo-time switch contacts have shorted then this would run the cold start valve continuously.

Another mistake made is the Control Pressure Regulator (grey plug) and the cold start valve (blue plug) are swapped over (even though they are colour coded!) The result of this would be to run the cold start valve continuously.

I am not saying that this is your problem but is a quick test to do.

Also check you have 12v at the centre pin of the idle speed ECu with the ignition key in position 2 ie just before the "starter motor" position. This will check to see if you have power fed to the idle speed ECU.

Did the problem occur at a single point in time ie after doing some work on the car or has this overfuelling been getting progressively worse?

NickT.

[Stuart Rees]

Wasn't this the Delorean powered by LPG not long ago. I guess the whole kit has now been removed. Has this previous modification affected one of the engine parts?
Stu

[Aaron]

It's still got the LPG option, but to do the MOT the engine had to be on unleaded.

I'll try out the suggestions and see if it helps.

[Dodgy Motor]

HHHMM,, as i remember if a vehicle is duel fuel it is tested on what ever fuel it is running on :? so if you turn up and its running gas, you test it on gas,,that must be a new rule change,,,again :?

[TheOriginalMrP]

Thing is, don't it specify the fuel on the MOT certificate? Most testers like to use the stored details on the MOT computer to ssave filling it all in. Maybe thats their excuse!

[Dodgy Motor]

I think the main rule is "AS PRESENTED FOR TEST"
you dont fiddle about to suit yourself, trouble is MOT testers know you are not going to appeal against things like that, so you are right Ben, its whatever is easier for them that wins :?

[Guinney1971]

when we took Phill's twin tank Cavalier for an MOT, we asked the MOT
station what fuel they were rather it was on (ie veggie oil or diesel).

They said diesel would be easier, as the fact that veggie oil produces no
emmissions would confuse the computer! :? :roll:

So, we got it MOT'd on diesel, then flipped the switch and put it back on
veg afterwards.

I think I'll speak to our MOT boys so that we know what the sp is for when
we convert our fleet to gas....

[steve.s]

hi

i know off topic a bit, but your veg oil, i take it you have a twin tank and water heat exchanger?. i have an 07 c4 picasso and i was looking to convert, if the high lift pump will take it!.

have you use 2nd handoil though as the new stuff now in aldi etc is getting more pricey!

back to the Delorean, i would assume that as it has to start on petrol anyway, then it should be tested on petrol.

if it ran ok before conversion then could have a problem due to it?.

is the switch over valve definately closing fully!.

[Dodgy Motor]

It would start on petrol, and if it were like my old
Daihatsu running LPG ,after it had warmed up it would switch its self to LPG. and seeing as the MOT test requires a warm engine it would mean that the MOT examiner would actually have to switch off the LPG therefore interfereing with the vehicle to suit the test, which goes against the rule of " AS PRESENTED FOR TEST"
I did actually have this argument once with a tester.. because sometimes if the LPG cut in a bit to early the poor old dear would backfire,
That would cause the ecu to go into "limp" mode,
and therefore it failed the test on emmisions, my argument was if he hadnt "fiddled with it" and turned off the gas it wouldnt have failed
Not that it really mattered, I just reset the ecu and it passed.
But I didnt go there again, :lol:

[Guinney1971]

steve.s Wrote:hi
i know off topic a bit, but your veg oil, i take it you have a twin tank and water heat exchanger?. i have an 07 c4 picasso and i was looking to convert, if the high lift pump will take it!.
have you use 2nd handoil though as the new stuff now in aldi etc is getting more pricey!

Hi Steve

first off, forget it on your Picasso - its too new and it WILL NOT run on veggie oil - and it may even be unsuitable for BioDiesel - check with Citroen first.

Phill's set up is a seperate 42 litre fuel tank with its own sender in the spare wheel well, a 6 port electric switchover valve and heat exchanger. In cold weather, the car starts on diesel, and as soon as the engine warms up, then just press the button on the dash and everything (including the fuel sender) switches over to the veggie tank.

We've been buying new oil from Costco, but the price has gone up over the last 6 months from 49p a litre to 69p a litre - which is still around 40p a litre less then diesel. We are sourcing a supply of pre-used veggie oil, which we will be filtering down to 5 microns (just bought the filters off ebay), and then running the cars on that. Best thing is, the used stuff is free - we will be doing the supplier a favour as normally they have to pay a company to come and take it away. The great thing with used oil, is that the car burns all the oil and produces virtually no emissions, and any 'bits' that are filtered out will go on my compost heap!

We're going to do a slightly different conversion on my diesel Cav, which will mean my car having a small diesel tank in the boot, and veggie oil going in the main tank, therefore meaning I'll have a better range and need to fill up less often.

The old Isuzu 1.7TD engined Cavaliers are perfect for running on veggie oil, plus they also have the all important Bosch fuel pump.

Anyone considering running their cars on 'bio diesel' or veggie oil should really check with either the manufacturer of their vehicle, or one of the many biofuel forums first tho to check compatibility.

Regards,

[steve.s]

hi

thanx for that

i did check the one site that did say, a 30 veggie oil mix in the main tank should be ok for the 1.6 HDi engine.

it also listed the xsara picaso (same engine i think) that someone had converted to a twin tank and was running ok.

has to be heated to 80 degrees, and run the last minute on diesel.

i was going to find out the manufacturer of pump, as i don't want to burn out the high lift one (£800+).

the C4 picaso i bought cheap...non runner flood damage.
with a new BSI unit and fuse box now runs and drives.

now just showing airbag and abs faults (have not checked and cleaned their ecu's yet).
car is brand new 5 miles on it!.

[Dodgy Motor]

Just to add a note to all this veggie fuel, you do realise you are liable for duty if you use it as road fuel, I think its about 20p per litre, but if they catch you and you havnt registered then say bye bye car
They are supposed to be reviewing the duty next year :?
You can use it for heating oil, duty free and If you payed any VAT on it you can claim that back Thats nice

[steve.s]

hi

it has been reviewed this year.

it is now legal to use the veggie oil without paying duty, up to a certain amount, <2500 litres. and how can they prove that!.

have a look at www.biotuning.co.uk

so well worth doing!.

so the best is go to a car auction, buy a 1.7D old shape astra, convert (£250) for a heat exchanger and filt+ solenoids and get the oil from your chippie.

as close to no cost motoring as you'll get!.