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+--- Thread: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? (/showthread.php?tid=4524)
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - Chris P - 20 Oct 2014
Yes a slight bit of price inflation! Its a pity its not been in a barn…it wouldn't have all that sun damage then. River find perhaps?
A big project for someone with a big price tag as well.
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - 88mph - 20 Oct 2014
Interesting thread, and looks a wrong-un, but I can't help but notice (in other threads) that so many owners see price inflation as a good thing. Believe me it isn't if you are an enthusiast.
We had this years ago in my old 'scene' of aircooled VW's.
Its great if you are a trader, auction house or getting out of the market for good.
When I got into old VW's you could buy Split-screen/bay campers for a few thousand pounds, spend a couple thousand getting them running/sorted, have fun & sell it on for near your outlay and move onto the next one.
Its a totally different market now, your investment is 10's of thousands, they are too expensive to use.
Even just owning the vehicle is costing you more, garages want more for any work, spares/panels are 10 X the cost, insurance goes up.
Ticking up by inflation (or there about) is nice, rapid growth becomes a nightmare for the enthusiast.
Its like home owners seeing 100% inflation as a good thing. Fine if your selling to move to Spain, a disaster if wanting a nicer area/bigger garden/double garage etc etc.
Just my experience like!
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - Darren C - 20 Oct 2014
88mph Wrote:Interesting thread, and looks a wrong-un, but I can't help but notice (in other threads) that so many owners see price inflation as a good thing. Believe me it isn't if you are an enthusiast.
We had this years ago in my old 'scene' of aircooled VW's.
Its great if you are a trader, auction house or getting out of the market for good.
When I got into old VW's you could buy Split-screen/bay campers for a few thousand pounds, spend a couple thousand getting them running/sorted, have fun & sell it on for near your outlay and move onto the next one.
Its a totally different market now, your investment is 10's of thousands, they are too expensive to use.
Even just owning the vehicle is costing you more, garages want more for any work, spares/panels are 10 X the cost, insurance goes up.
Ticking up by inflation (or there about) is nice, rapid growth becomes a nightmare for the enthusiast.
Its like home owners seeing 100% inflation as a good thing. Fine if your selling to move to Spain, a disaster if wanting a nicer area/bigger garden/double garage etc etc.
Just my experience like!
What
Twaddle, we should rejoice in price rise rather than claim "the end of the world is nigh!"
This is life passing you by 88mph.
Its all relative. I used to buy split screen vans for £300, beetles for £20 and drive them around until they fell apart. We once went on a road trip to Skegness in a 63 split van, it broke down 3 times on the way so we took off the numberplates and dumped it in a layby, left it as scrap and got the train home. Mind you I only earned £25 a week on a YTS scheme so £300 was 3 months wages then.
My advice if you want to buy a Delorean is jump on the boat now before it sails.
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - Chris Williams - 20 Oct 2014
Quote:Twaddle, we should rejoice in price rise rather than claim "the end of the world is nigh!"LOL
With the amount of cars being shipped back over the last year/next six months I think the values will ease off a bit soon. I think they are getting to the peak now. But that's just my opinion
Chris
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - Darren C - 20 Oct 2014
I agree Chris,
The peak (in my opinion; based on other classic car value increases today) should be:
£30K minimum for a LHD with MOT (needing improvement)
£40K for a RHD (in good condition)
Exceptional examples of each should command another 15-20% more
Gains are of course to be made by self imports by those not willing to "take a risk"
After all it is a sellers market :wink:
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - 88mph - 20 Oct 2014
I think my points must of been mis-understood, but hey ho, no worries.
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - Chris P - 21 Oct 2014
As a matter if interest, if you take inflation into account, cars were selling in the UK at auction in 1983 at about £10k LHD and £14k RHD which is roughly £32K and £45K in todays money. There were exceptions to this, with some making more and some less, but its interesting.
Its also true that 8 years ago you could buy a fixer upper from the USA for about £5k….in fact I bought one ( off a 3rd party) for £6k It was a bit of a mess but needed no major work at all. It took me 2 weeks to get it running, respectable and MOT'd.
I wish i'd got a shedload of them now!
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - Chris P - 21 Oct 2014
Its worth noting that it was bought from a small add in a local paper from the swamps of Louisiana . You can still view them online apparently.
It was all done on trust and from the UK, with its very nice elderly owner called "Herman"…..all details fixed up during several phone calls.
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - Darren C - 21 Oct 2014
Chris P Wrote:As a matter if interest, if you take inflation into account, cars were selling in the UK at auction in 1983 at about £10k LHD and £14k RHD which is roughly £32K and £45K in todays money. There were exceptions to this, with some making more and some less, but its interesting.
Yes interesting Chris, and sort of confirms my estimate values.
You could also compare the market rise with the base Porsche 911 (SC 3.2) Deloreans used this as a price comparison when sold new. In the 90's you could buy a good secondhand one all day long at £10K (same sort of money as a good De) they sat for 10 years at £10K, then all of a sudden 5 or 6 years ago started to creep up....£15K....just like De's. Today a good example 911 of the era (nothing special) are exchanging hands at £30K, so it follows that the Delorean which has mirrored the 911 all its life should do the same.
After all, most other classics have doubled if not trebled in value over the last 5 years. Just look at old Fords, Stags, Jensens etc.
You will always however find "cheap" cars, its all about how much time and money you are prepared to plough into it to get it back in shape.
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - Rissy - 21 Oct 2014
I for one am happy with the value of our cars going up. (Maybe it's a pride thing?)
But...I think all-time low interest rates have had their part in classic values going up. When people had no other (stable) place to invest their money, they invested in classics, with the hopes of them giving a better return than the banks.
Let's see what happens when interest rates return to a more normal figure and the flurry for buying up d cars stops and then goes into remission again. A flood of classics on the market when people choose to return to investing their money using banks again could cause the values to drop again unless demand still outstrips supply...
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - 88mph - 21 Oct 2014
Rissy Wrote:I for one am happy with the value of our cars going up. (Maybe it's a pride thing?)
But...I think all-time low interest rates have had their part in classic values going up. When people had no other (stable) place to invest their money, they invested in classics, with the hopes of them giving a better return than the banks.
Let's see what happens when interest rates return to a more normal figure and the flurry for buying up d cars stops and then goes into remission again. A flood of classics on the market when people choose to return to investing their money using banks again could cause the values to drop again unless demand still outstrips supply...
This ^^^^. No one knows what will happen once, easier to store :lol: , assets return, but if you are into the car, and not just viewing as an investment.
Rapidly rising values are not always a good thing. In fact, I'd guess, many classic rally drivers have had to step away from the very cool classic 911's, because the costs/risks have just got too great.
But hey, its just my opinion/twaddle. Peace out! :lol:
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - Darren C - 21 Oct 2014
Dear twaddle-doom-meister :wink:
Being priced out is not a concern of a true enthusiast, you just make sacrifices and do what it takes. If you want something bad enough you make it happen, you control your own destiny.
I doubt anyone has been priced out of classic Porsche rallying either based on risk & value.
In 2010 there was 15 Ferrari GTO's racing hammer and tong around Goodwood, bumper to bumper and knock for knock. Each car worth £30 million pounds EACH. A mere £30K Porsche dropping out of rallying on the grounds of costs/risk is just plain ridiculous.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9GSs2ru8VM
Marvelous stuff....long live those with the balls to race great classic cars!
To get the thread back on track, the same applies to buying a Delorean or assessing its value.
It is what it is, no good complaining about it.
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - 88mph - 21 Oct 2014
Errrrmmmm, Just because some can afford to risk 30million pounds doesn't mean others can does it? :?
What if the delorean suddenly became a 100,000 pound car, how many here could/would maintain, insure, use it?
A friend still rally's old aircooled 911's, he can afford to, many other 'enthusiasts' have had to stop.
But you obviously know better, so I'll leave it now.
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - Darren C - 22 Oct 2014
The observation I’m making here is that if someone takes a personal decision not to do something based upon their circumstances, there is always someone else to step forward and take over. I only air an opinion based upon experience. I have been fortunate to drive classic’s and sports cars for over 30 years including 20 years owning and driving many 911’s. I have raced them and even crashed and rolled a 911. You dust yourself off and get back on the horse. I’m not having a personal dig at you, just your pessimistic opinions and delusion of enthusiasts being priced out of the classic car market. As I said earlier people will just do what it takes to achieve their dream. Pretty much in the same way that the house price increase over the last 50 years hasn’t stopped people buying houses.
It just plain inflation and the market economy that causes the price rise. Why shouldn’t Delorean prices rise equally with all other classic car marques? You can’t cap them just because your own personal opinion is that it’s too expensive.
I agree with Rissy that the market will peak at some point, but I don’t think it’ll drop off a cliff like it did in the early 90’s; but just stabilise on a higher plateau for another 10 years.
Re: Worth importing this '82 D as a project? - Chris P - 22 Oct 2014
Ive no problems with whats been said…I would just prefer it if come comments were slightly less 'cutting' . The DeLorean owners club is well know for being welcoming and helpful to its junior and aspiring membership. That's one of the reasons were are continuing to be successful. Those of you who go to the NEC will know exactly what I mean.
I have been into classic cars from the early 60's. Ive owned and run a Chrome plating firm for 35 years dealing with dozens of classic car owners and restorers on a daily basis and also I've owned 15 DeLoreans.
My personal observations on the price of classic cars are that there is definitely a lot of 'froth'....at the top end of the market and this has undoubtably dragged up some cars from the bottom end to. One day this will peak and fall in as some investors get out and go into gold or wine or property..or what ever.
The DeLorean occupies a unique place in the market. There are very few of them for a start. Very few come up for sale, there is a young keen fan base of non-owners eager to own one. The prices have never reached 'silly' levels, just steadily raising over the years….with a bit of a spike recently. I can only see this trend continuing. I'd sooner own one, that be trying to buy one
…but thats just the reality of the current market. I know nothing about Porshe's or racing or motor sports, so won't comment on them. ….Keep it friendly folk…please..